Episode Transcript

[00:00:03] Speaker A: This podcast is a little different to the usual run. I'm releasing it on the anniversary of the death of my father and my teacher, who taught me about systems, the need to understand the complete system and the values I try to live by.

I hope that you will find it interesting.

[00:00:28] Speaker B: Welcome back, everyone. Ready for another deep dive?

[00:00:31] Speaker C: Always.

[00:00:32] Speaker B: Well, today we're taking a look at a story from World War II.

[00:00:35] Speaker C: Okay.

[00:00:36] Speaker B: But not the kind you might immediately think of. We're going to be talking about Rabbi Moses Jakob Kasser.

[00:00:43] Speaker C: Oh, fascinating.

[00:00:44] Speaker B: He was a German Jewish refugee and, well, he ended up leading a mobile fighting Keela within the British Army.

[00:00:51] Speaker C: A mobile fighting Keela?

[00:00:53] Speaker B: Yeah. So. So that's kind of what we're going to be unpacking today.

[00:00:55] Speaker C: Yeah. A rabbi leading soldiers. That's definitely not something you hear every day. So how did this come about?

[00:01:00] Speaker B: Right. Like, how did this happen? Well, to do that, we're primarily using Kasser's own book called 87Co PDF. And this book is. It's really wild, actually. It's like a mix of everything. Personal accounts, sermons that he gave, artwork, and then even some historical documents.

[00:01:18] Speaker C: Wow. So it's like a multifaceted view into this. This community, this experience.

[00:01:23] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. And I think what makes this deep dive so compelling is that we get to see this incredibly personal and intimate perspective of these soldiers, many of whom, by the way, had just fled Nazi persecution.

[00:01:35] Speaker C: Right.

[00:01:35] Speaker B: So they're grappling with their identity in this new country amidst a global conflict.

[00:01:41] Speaker C: I mean, that's. Talk about layers of complexity. Yeah. Trying to figure out who you are, where you belong, all while the world is, well, quite literally at war. It's been incredibly challenging.

[00:01:52] Speaker B: For sure. Okay, so let's rewind a bit back to 1939. This is where Castor story begins. He escapes Nazi Germany and arrives in England.

[00:02:01] Speaker C: Okay.

[00:02:01] Speaker B: But he had to make this, I mean, just heart wrenching decision to leave his mother behind.

[00:02:06] Speaker C: Oh, wow.

[00:02:07] Speaker B: He was a qualified rabbi and teacher. When he gets to England, facing a very uncertain future.

[00:02:11] Speaker C: Right. So he's already gone through so much upheaval.

[00:02:13] Speaker B: Exactly. And then just as he's kind of starting to rebuild his life, World War II breaks out.

[00:02:19] Speaker C: Oh, wow. So. So what does he do? Does he try to find, I don't know, a traditional kind of religious role to help his community?

[00:02:25] Speaker B: So you would think, right?

[00:02:27] Speaker C: Yeah, that's. That's what seems to make sense.

[00:02:28] Speaker B: Yeah. But instead, instead he volunteers for the British Army.

[00:02:32] Speaker C: Really?

[00:02:33] Speaker B: Yeah. This is in 1940, and he's assigned to the 87th Company of the Pioneer Corps.

[00:02:38] Speaker C: The Pioneer Corps. Didn't they mainly do a lot of the manual labor for the Army?

[00:02:42] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. A lot of heavy lifting, building, you know, kind of the support work for the Army. So not exactly what you'd picture a rabbi doing, right?

[00:02:52] Speaker C: No, not at all. I mean, wouldn't he have been more valuable, you know, serving in a more traditional religious role, especially during a time like this?

[00:03:02] Speaker B: I mean, you would think so, right?

[00:03:03] Speaker C: Yeah, like providing spiritual guidance and comfort. I mean, people must have been, well, terrified and uncertain about the future. It seems like a rabbi could have played a really important role in helping them cope.

[00:03:14] Speaker B: Absolutely. And that's what makes his choice so interesting. It seems like his decision to join a labor unit like that was driven by this desire to be with his community.

[00:03:23] Speaker C: His community. Okay, so were there a lot of other Jewish refugees in the Pioneer Corps?

[00:03:28] Speaker B: Well, particularly in the 87th company, which is where he was assigned. A lot of them, yeah. Jewish refugees from Germany.

[00:03:34] Speaker C: Ah, I see. So in a way, he was choosing to serve alongside those who. Who truly understood what he'd been through, who shared his heritage.

[00:03:43] Speaker B: That's exactly it.

[00:03:44] Speaker C: Okay, that makes sense. So instead of leading a congregation in a synagogue, he ends up leading a company of soldiers, you know, digging trenches and unloading ships.

[00:03:53] Speaker B: Yeah, that's pretty much it. But even in this very unlikely setting, Kasser found a way to, like, create a mobile fighting keela.

[00:04:01] Speaker C: A mobile fighting keela. That sounds almost like a contradiction in terms.

[00:04:05] Speaker B: Right? Like, how do you reconcile those two ideas?

[00:04:08] Speaker C: Yeah, I mean, fighting in community, those don't usually go hand in hand.

[00:04:12] Speaker B: Right, but he kind of saw it as, like, his mission. He became an unofficial chaplain, a spiritual leader for all these soldiers. And the way he approached maintaining Jewish observance within the unit, it was this fascinating blend of, like, sticking to tradition while adapting to, well, the reality of being in the army.

[00:04:30] Speaker C: Wow, that must have been tricky. So how did he actually do that? How did he balance those two things?

[00:04:34] Speaker B: Well, for instance, he really fought hard to make sure his company could observe Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur.

[00:04:40] Speaker C: Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur. Those are the high holy days. Right. A really important time of reflection and repentance.

[00:04:46] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. And imagine trying to observe these very solemn holidays while serving in the army. It's a testament to, I think, Kasser's commitment, his leadership.

[00:04:57] Speaker C: Absolutely. I mean, to even think about trying to make that happen in the middle of a war, it's remarkable.

[00:05:03] Speaker B: Yeah, it's Incredible. And there's even a story about a dance being postponed because somebody realized that most of the soldiers would be observing the high holidays. It's like a small victory, but it speaks volumes.

[00:05:15] Speaker C: Yeah. It shows how much respect he was able to gain, not through, like, rank or authority, but through hard work and camaraderie.

[00:05:23] Speaker B: Totally. He was truly committed to his men.

[00:05:25] Speaker C: It sounds like he really led by example, didn't he?

[00:05:27] Speaker B: Yeah. And it wasn't just about religious observance either. He really encouraged everyone to, like, learn and grow in every aspect of life. He actually took a bookkeeping course just as an example for others.

[00:05:40] Speaker C: Wow. Leading from the trenches, literally and figuratively. That's amazing.

[00:05:45] Speaker B: It is. And you know what's even more incredible? He actually inspired two soldiers to convert back to Judaism.

[00:05:50] Speaker C: To convert back?

[00:05:52] Speaker B: Yeah. They were just so drawn in by the, like, the strength of the community he had created.

[00:05:57] Speaker C: Wow. I hadn't even considered that.

[00:05:59] Speaker B: Yeah.

[00:06:00] Speaker C: It makes you think about the human need for connection, especially in, well, times of crisis, for sure.

[00:06:06] Speaker B: So here we have this rabbi leading a company of Jewish soldiers. Many of them had a Fled persecution. They're trying to hold on to their faith and identity in the middle of a war. It's. It's pretty mind blowing, actually.

[00:06:17] Speaker C: Yeah. It really makes you wonder, like, what was that like for them on a daily basis? What were they thinking and feeling? Do we have any insight into that?

[00:06:25] Speaker B: Well, that's where Caster's sermons and artwork come in. Yeah. They offer us a unique window into their. Their inner lives, their thoughts and their emotions. And trust me, these are not your dry theological lectures.

[00:06:38] Speaker C: Okay, so what are they like? Give us a sense of. Of what these sermons and this artwork were like.

[00:06:43] Speaker B: Okay, so imagine this. We've got this piece called Crossing the Red Sea, 1940 style. And it visually connects their escape from Nazi Germany with the Israelites exodus from Egypt.

[00:06:55] Speaker C: Wow. That's powerful. Tapping into this ancient story of liberation to make sense of their own experience.

[00:07:01] Speaker B: Exactly. It's like this reminder of how they drew strength and resilience from their shared history.

[00:07:06] Speaker C: Right. I mean, everyone understands that story. It's almost universal.

[00:07:09] Speaker B: Yeah. But as you might expect, it wasn't all about, you know, finding solace in tradition. I mean, these soldiers, like any diverse group, they had internal conflicts, prejudices.

[00:07:18] Speaker C: Oh, I see. So there were tensions within the unit.

[00:07:21] Speaker B: Yeah. Some even tried to distance themselves from their Jewish identity.

[00:07:24] Speaker C: Oh, wow, that's. That's really interesting. So how did Casser handle that?

[00:07:28] Speaker B: Well, that's where you see his sensitivity and Empathy as a leader. There's this one instance where a soldier makes this anti Semitic remark.

[00:07:37] Speaker C: Oh, no.

[00:07:37] Speaker B: Yeah. But Kasser doesn't just let it slide. He addresses it head on and uses it as this. This powerful moral lesson for the whole company.

[00:07:47] Speaker C: That's great. So he wasn't afraid to confront prejudice directly. That takes guts.

[00:07:51] Speaker B: Yeah. And he also had to deal with some really complex situations. Like there's this one case of a soldier who was married to a non Jewish woman.

[00:08:00] Speaker C: Okay, so how did he approach that?

[00:08:02] Speaker B: Instead of, like, strictly enforcing religious dogma, he. He focused on the soldier's character. He really tried to, like, encourage understanding within the unit.

[00:08:10] Speaker C: That sounds really progressive for the time, actually, to prioritize individual character over, well, strict adherence to the rules.

[00:08:17] Speaker B: Yeah, he wasn't about blind adherence to rules. He really wanted people to. To think for themselves, to connect with their faith in a personal way.

[00:08:25] Speaker C: Okay, so he's dealing with all these challenges within the unit, but what about his interactions with the larger Jewish community? Were they supportive of his efforts?

[00:08:32] Speaker B: Well, it's actually kind of surprising. Even within the Jewish community itself, he faced challenges, specifically with some of the official Jewish chaplains. He felt they were really out of touch with what the soldiers actually needed.

[00:08:45] Speaker C: Out of touch? How so?

[00:08:47] Speaker B: He thought they were too focused on, like, formalities, not enough on actually providing, like, genuine spiritual support.

[00:08:55] Speaker C: Ah, okay. So it was like a clash of approaches. He was more focused on meeting people where they were at, while the chaplains were more traditional, Maybe even a bit rigid.

[00:09:03] Speaker B: Yeah, I think that's a good way to put it. And. And there's this anecdote. It's almost funny, but also kind of sad. This chaplain delivers a sermon. Right.

[00:09:11] Speaker C: Okay.

[00:09:11] Speaker B: But it turns out it's a recycled sermon from the previous year.

He.

[00:09:16] Speaker C: He just gave the same sermon again?

[00:09:17] Speaker B: Yeah. Can you imagine sitting there and, like, you've heard this all before? It had to be so frustrating for Casser and the soldiers.

[00:09:24] Speaker C: I mean, it's like, hello, wake up. There's a war going on, and you're just phoning it in.

It makes me think about how important it is to feel seen and understood, especially in times of crisis. Like, you're not just a number.

[00:09:38] Speaker B: Exactly. And I think this highlights, like, the disconnect that existed between these established religious institutions and the reality that these soldiers were facing.

[00:09:48] Speaker C: Right. Like a huge gap between the theory and the practice.

[00:09:51] Speaker B: Yeah.

[00:09:51] Speaker C: So what happened after the war? Did Casser continue his work with the Jewish community?

[00:09:56] Speaker B: He did. Even after the war, he was still wrestling with these Questions of faith and identity. He became a teacher and a Beatle in Cardiff, in London.

[00:10:07] Speaker C: Okay.

[00:10:07] Speaker B: And we have this letter that he wrote. It's really thought provoking to Jewish parents in 1963.

[00:10:13] Speaker C: What did he write about? What was he so concerned about?

[00:10:16] Speaker B: Well, he was basically issuing this, like, call to action. He was saying how incredibly important parental involvement is in Jewish education. He believed that teaching children about their heritage at home, that was. That was the foundation, the foundation for.

[00:10:28] Speaker C: A strong Jewish identity. Okay. So that was his focus later in life. But let's go back to his time in the Pioneer Corps for a minute. I mean, what was it about that experience that really shaped his thinking? What were the key takeaways from his wartime leadership?

[00:10:42] Speaker B: Right. Like, what can we learn from all of this?

[00:10:45] Speaker C: Well, I think one of the most important lessons is that tradition needs to adapt.

[00:10:50] Speaker B: Adapt?

[00:10:51] Speaker C: Yeah, like, to fit the needs of the community. Now, he didn't compromise on his core values at all, but he understood that faith. You have to live it. You can't just preach it.

[00:11:02] Speaker B: It's about action, not just words.

[00:11:04] Speaker C: Exactly. And sometimes you have to be flexible to really live your faith.

[00:11:08] Speaker B: That makes sense. I mean, he was in a very unusual situation, to say the least.

[00:11:12] Speaker C: Right. And he also showed how powerful leading by example can be. He didn't just, you know, tell his men what to do. He showed them through his own actions.

[00:11:21] Speaker B: Right. He was right there with them, digging the trenches alongside them, fighting for their.

[00:11:25] Speaker C: Religious freedom and encouraging them to constantly learn and grow.

[00:11:28] Speaker B: So it was about empowerment, too.

[00:11:30] Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. And let's not forget how much he emphasized building a sense of community. He knew that especially in the face of adversity, people need to feel connected to something bigger than themselves. Yeah. Like you're part of something meaningful, something that gives you strength and support.

[00:11:45] Speaker B: Right. And his mobile fighting, Hila, it wasn't limited to, like, a physical place. It was a spirit, a way of.

[00:11:53] Speaker C: Being that transcended the boundaries of wartime.

[00:11:56] Speaker B: Exactly. And that spirit of community, it's something we can all cultivate in our own lives. Yeah. No matter what our background is, what our beliefs are.

[00:12:04] Speaker C: Absolutely. We all face challenges. We all need support, and we all have something to offer.

[00:12:08] Speaker B: Right. And Kasser's legacy, it shows us that even in the most unexpected places, we can find meaning, purpose, and connection.

[00:12:16] Speaker C: That's really beautiful. Okay, so we've talked about Kasser's leadership, his commitment to community, but what about his specific understanding of Judaism? You mentioned this idea of Yiddishkeit earlier. Can you elaborate on that?

[00:12:27] Speaker B: A Bit, Yeah. So Yiddishkeit is often translated as Jewishness, Right?

[00:12:31] Speaker C: Right.

[00:12:31] Speaker B: But for Kasser, it wasn't just a label. It wasn't just about rituals. It was a philosophy, a way of life.

[00:12:37] Speaker C: I see. So it was more about how you lived your life, your actions, your intentions.

[00:12:42] Speaker B: Exactly. He believed that living a life of holiness meant constantly striving to be fit for purpose in God's world.

[00:12:48] Speaker C: Fit for purpose. Okay, so how did he define that? What did that mean to him, practically speaking?

[00:12:54] Speaker B: Well, it involved being conscious, aware, taking responsibility for your actions.

[00:13:01] Speaker C: So it's like an act of faith. You're not just passively accepting things. You're engaging with the world, trying to make a positive impact.

[00:13:07] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. It's about aligning your life with. With a higher purpose. And it wasn't just about individual actions either. He really emphasized the social dimension of Yiddishkeit, the idea that, like, a Jew cannot exist in isolation.

[00:13:21] Speaker C: Oh, that's interesting. So community is essential to this understanding of Jewishness.

[00:13:26] Speaker B: It's crucial. He often talked about the importance of, you know, supporting each other not just in times of joy, but also in times of sorrow. He used the example of needing a minyan, a quorum of 10 Jewish adults, for certain prayers.

[00:13:38] Speaker C: Ah, right. The idea that you need a community to fully engage in religious life. You can't do it alone.

[00:13:44] Speaker B: Right. We're stronger together.

[00:13:45] Speaker C: Okay, so he's connecting this ancient tradition to the very real challenges faced by his soldiers. Right. They were literally fighting a war together, relying on each other for survival.

[00:13:55] Speaker B: Yeah. And Kasser understood the need to reinforce.

[00:13:58] Speaker C: Those bonds through shared rituals. Tradition. Okay, that makes sense. So community was one aspect of Yiddishkeit. What else did he emphasize?

[00:14:06] Speaker B: He also placed a huge emphasis on learning, like studying Jewish history, literature, law. For him, Yiddishkeit wasn't about blind faith.

[00:14:15] Speaker C: Right. It was about engaging with the tradition intellectually, thoughtfully, critically, even.

[00:14:19] Speaker B: Exactly. And he saw this as an antidote to, like, the emptiness he perceived in modern life.

[00:14:25] Speaker C: Okay, so it was about finding meaning and purpose through connecting with this rich heritage.

[00:14:30] Speaker B: Right. And that brings us back to, like, his emphasis on Jewish education, not just for children, but for adults as well.

[00:14:36] Speaker C: Lifelong learning. That's great. So he believed that learning should be this ongoing journey, a way to constantly deepen your understanding of your faith, your place in the world. That's really inspiring. Did he have any, like, unique approaches to teaching? I mean, how did he explain these complex ideas, especially to, like, younger audiences?

[00:14:56] Speaker B: Oh, he did. He was known for making complex Jewish concepts relatable and engaging, even for kids.

[00:15:02] Speaker C: Oh, that's fantastic. I mean, how do you make something like Yom Kippur, which is all about, you know, repentance and atonement, exciting for a nine year old.

[00:15:09] Speaker B: Well, he had this brilliant way of doing it. He used stories and examples that they could connect with. Like, remember that time when he was explaining Yom Kippur to a class of nine year olds?

[00:15:17] Speaker C: Yeah, vaguely.

[00:15:18] Speaker B: He connected to the story of Moses breaking the tablets after the Israelites worshiped the golden calf.

[00:15:24] Speaker C: Ah, right. That's a great story. So he took this ancient, you know, theological idea and made it relevant to their lives.

[00:15:31] Speaker B: Exactly. He didn't talk down to them. He used language they understood. And then he connected it to the idea of making and breaking promises. He talked about exams, you know, and playing cricket instead of studying. He was showing them that these ancient stories, they still have relevance to their lives.

[00:15:48] Speaker C: That's really cool. He was making these, well, frankly, sometimes heavy and complex themes accessible. It's like he was opening up this whole world of meaning and tradition to them in a way that made sense. Did he have any other interesting interpretations of, like, holidays or traditions?

[00:16:05] Speaker B: He did. He had a unique perspective on Purim.

[00:16:08] Speaker C: Purim, the one with the costumes and the noisemakers?

[00:16:11] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. It's his joyous, raucous holiday.

[00:16:14] Speaker C: Yeah, lots of fun. What's his take on it?

[00:16:16] Speaker B: Well, he saw it as a reflection of the complexities of, you know, Jewish identity, especially for those who had tried to distance themselves from their heritage.

[00:16:24] Speaker C: Oh, interesting. Like you can try to run away from your roots, but they'll always find a way to pull you back.

[00:16:29] Speaker B: Exactly. He talked about this almost involuntary pullback to tradition, this feeling of being unable to escape where you came from. He argued that, like the unconventional celebration of Purim, with all the revelry and, you know, even controlled chaos, it was like a release valve.

[00:16:47] Speaker C: A release valve?

[00:16:47] Speaker B: Yeah, a way of acknowledging the tensions between assimilation and tradition. Like, you can try to fit in, to blend in, but there's still this part of you that's connected to your heritage, to your past. And Purim was a way to acknowledge that, to celebrate it, even.

[00:17:03] Speaker C: That's fascinating. So even in this joyous, almost chaotic celebration, he saw these deeper layers of meaning.

[00:17:09] Speaker B: Yeah, he was always looking for the deeper meaning. And he wasn't afraid to challenge the status quo.

[00:17:13] Speaker C: Oh, right. Didn't he have some run ins with the authorities at Jews College and even with some of the official chaplains in the army?

[00:17:19] Speaker B: He did. He was told that he knew too much Hebrew when he applied to Jews College.

[00:17:24] Speaker C: Too much Hebrew. That's ridiculous.

[00:17:26] Speaker B: Right? It's like they saw his knowledge and passion as a threat, and he ran into that same resistance from some of the chaplains later on.

[00:17:33] Speaker C: So how did he deal with that?

[00:17:34] Speaker B: Well, Casser wasn't one to be silenced. He knew that true faith wasn't about, you know, blindly obeying authority.

[00:17:41] Speaker C: It was about engaging with the tradition in a meaningful way.

[00:17:44] Speaker B: Yeah, even if it meant questioning authority.

[00:17:47] Speaker C: That takes courage, especially during a time of war, when conformity is often so highly valued.

[00:17:53] Speaker B: Absolutely. So that brings us back to the big question.

What can we as listeners in the 21st century? What can we take away from all of this? What are the lasting lessons here?

[00:18:03] Speaker C: That's a good question. I mean, Kasser's story is so unique, so specific to his time and place, but I think there are some universal truths that we can glean from his experience. What do you think?

[00:18:14] Speaker B: I think so too. I think one of the biggest takeaways is this idea that even in the darkest of times, hope can flourish.

[00:18:21] Speaker C: Hope can flourish. I like that.

[00:18:23] Speaker B: He and his men, they face some truly unimaginable challenges.

[00:18:27] Speaker C: Yeah. Leaving their homes, their families, facing persecution, then a war. It's hard to even fathom.

[00:18:34] Speaker B: Right. But they found a way to maintain their faith, their community, their sense of purpose.

[00:18:39] Speaker C: That's a powerful message. Gives me chills, actually. But it also makes me wonder how Casser dealt with the. Well, the inevitable moments of doubt or despair. I mean, did he ever question his faith or his purpose?

[00:18:52] Speaker B: I'm sure he did. He definitely experienced moments of frustration, disappointment, especially in his interactions with, you know, those who he felt weren't serving the community well, but his writing, it ultimately reflects this deep faith, even in the face of suffering.

[00:19:08] Speaker C: So it's not about pretending that everything is okay. It's about finding that inner strength to persevere, even when things are tough.

[00:19:16] Speaker B: Exactly. He believed in the power of good, the possibility of redemption, even when surrounded by, well, a lot of darkness.

[00:19:23] Speaker C: That's really inspiring. What else can we learn from him? What other lessons can we apply to our own lives?

[00:19:27] Speaker B: Well, his story really challenges us to be courageous in our own convictions. Kasser wasn't afraid to speak truth to power.

[00:19:34] Speaker C: Right. Even when it was uncomfortable or even risky.

[00:19:36] Speaker B: Yeah. To challenge authority, even within his own faith.

[00:19:39] Speaker C: And he wasn't just complaining. He was offering solutions. Working to create a better, more supportive community.

[00:19:45] Speaker B: Exactly. And that's something I think we can all strive for. To not just point out problems, but to actively work towards solutions to be a part of positive change.

[00:19:53] Speaker C: Absolutely. And that idea of leadership being about empathy and example, that really resonates with me. It's a good reminder that true leadership isn't about holding a position, it's about serving others.

[00:20:06] Speaker B: Yeah. It's about leading from the heart, leading with compassion and understanding.

[00:20:09] Speaker C: And Kasser's mobile fighting Keela, as you said, it wasn't confined to a physical location. It was a spirit, a way of.

[00:20:16] Speaker B: Being that transcended the boundaries of wartime. And I think that's something we can all carry with us. That spirit of community, of support, of connection.

[00:20:23] Speaker C: I agree. His story really is a testament to the resilience of the human spirit and the enduring importance of faith, community, and leadership. But before we wrap up this part of our deep dive, there's one more aspect of Casser's thinking that I think is worth exploring a bit further.

You mentioned earlier how he saw Yiddishkeit as a way of life, as more than just a set of rituals or beliefs. Can you give us a concrete example of how he actually lived out this philosophy? How did Yiddishkaya manifest in his daily life, especially during his time in the pioneer corps?

[00:20:58] Speaker B: You know, that's such a great question, and it's one that I think really gets to the heart of what made Casser such a remarkable figure? You know, that's such a great question, and it's one that I think really gets to the heart of what made Casser such a remarkable figure.

[00:21:10] Speaker C: I agree it's easy to talk about these concepts in the abstract, but I'm curious to see how they played out in his day to day life.

[00:21:15] Speaker B: Right, exactly. Like, how did this philosophy actually translate into action? Well, I think one of the clearest examples is his determination to secure leave for Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur for his company.

[00:21:27] Speaker C: Ah, yes, that was really remarkable. I mean, to even attempt that in the middle of a war, it's just incredible.

[00:21:35] Speaker B: It really is. And I think for Kasser, it wasn't just about following religious rules, you know, it was about creating a space for his men, a space for them to connect with something larger than themselves, to reflect, to renew their sense of purpose.

[00:21:48] Speaker C: Even amidst the chaos of war. So it was about finding that deeper meaning even in the toughest of circumstances.

[00:21:54] Speaker B: Exactly. And it wasn't just about individual reflection either. Remember how he emphasized that social dimension of Yiddishkeit, like a Jew cannot exist in isolation?

[00:22:04] Speaker C: Right, right. He often spoke about the importance of community, of supporting one another, not just in times of joy. But in sorrow as well.

[00:22:11] Speaker B: Yeah. And I think his time in the Pioneer Corps really brought that idea to life. I mean, they were literally fighting a war together, relying on each other for surv.

[00:22:18] Speaker C: Absolutely. And Casser understood the need to reinforce those bonds, those connections, through their shared rituals and traditions.

[00:22:26] Speaker B: Yes. It's fascinating how he connected those ancient traditions to the modern day challenges they were facing.

[00:22:33] Speaker C: It really is. Okay, so community was a key aspect of his understanding of Yiddishkeit. What else?

[00:22:39] Speaker B: Well, he also constantly emphasized the importance of learning, of studying Jewish history, literature and law. He didn't see Yiddishkeit as this kind of blind faith. It was about engaging with tradition in a critical, thoughtful way.

[00:22:52] Speaker C: Right. He wanted people to understand their faith, not just blindly accept it.

[00:22:56] Speaker B: Exactly. And you know, he saw this as an antidote to what he perceived as, like, the emptiness of modern life. Like true fulfillment came from connecting with something larger than yourself, with a heritage that spans centuries.

[00:23:08] Speaker C: I see. So it was about finding meaning and purpose by connecting to this, well, this incredibly rich and complex tradition.

[00:23:15] Speaker B: Yes. And that brings us back to his, like, almost obsessive focus on Jewish education. Right. Not just for children, but for adults too.

[00:23:22] Speaker C: Lifelong learning, always striving to deepen your understanding. I like that. So did he have any, like, unique methods for teaching or was he pretty traditional in his approach?

[00:23:32] Speaker B: Oh, he definitely had a knack for making things relatable and engaging, even for kids. Like, remember that example of him explaining Yom Kippur to a class of nine year olds?

[00:23:42] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, that was pretty creative. How did he do that? I mean, Yom Kippur is. Well, it's a pretty serious holiday. How do you make that fun for a nine year old?

[00:23:50] Speaker B: Right, but he had this way of connecting those ancient ideas to their lives. So he connected Yom Kippur to the story of Moses breaking the tablets after, you know, the whole golden calf incident.

[00:24:03] Speaker C: Wow, that's a good one. Kids love that story. So he used that as a way to explain the concept of repentance.

[00:24:08] Speaker B: Exactly. He didn't talk down to them. He met them where they were at. He talked about making and breaking promises. He used examples like exams, you know, or playing cricket instead of studying. It was brilliant.

[00:24:20] Speaker C: That's really cool. He was showing them that these ancient stories, these traditions, they weren't just relics of the past. They actually had something to say about their lives, about the choices they made every day.

[00:24:31] Speaker B: Yeah, he was a master at making those connections. And he didn't shy away from the tough questions either. Remember how they asked him If Moses smashed the tablets on purpose.

[00:24:40] Speaker C: Yeah, I bet that was a tough one to answer. So what did he say?

[00:24:44] Speaker B: He answered so honestly. He said, you know, we don't know for sure, but what we do know is that sometimes we make mistakes, sometimes we break promises, and it's important to own up to those mistakes and try to do better next time.

[00:24:57] Speaker C: That's such a great message, and it's so relevant even today. It's about taking responsibility for your actions, acknowledging when you've messed up, and striving to be better. It's about growth, really.

[00:25:08] Speaker B: Exactly. It wasn't about being perfect. It was about constantly striving to improve, to align your actions with your values.

[00:25:14] Speaker C: So he was great at explaining these complex concepts to kids. Did he have any other, like, unique interpretations of Jewish traditions?

[00:25:23] Speaker B: He did. He had this really interesting perspective on Purim, you know, the holiday with the costumes and the noisemaking.

[00:25:29] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, Purim. The one where everyone gets a little bit wild. What was his take on that?

[00:25:34] Speaker B: Well, he saw it as a reflection of the complexities of Jewish identity, especially for those who had tried to assimilate to distance themselves from their heritage.

[00:25:43] Speaker C: Oh, that's fascinating. So, like, you can try to run away from your roots, but they'll always find a way to pull you back.

[00:25:48] Speaker B: Exactly. He talked about this almost involuntary pullback to tradition, this feeling of like you can't escape where you came from. He argued that the way Purim is celebrated, all the revelry and, you know, even a bit of controlled chaos, it was like a release valve.

[00:26:03] Speaker C: A release valve for what?

[00:26:05] Speaker B: For those tensions between assimilation and tradition. You can try to fit in, to blend in, but there's still this part of you that's connected to your heritage, to your past. And Purim was a way to acknowledge that, to celebrate it, even.

[00:26:18] Speaker C: That's really insightful. So even in this, you know, joyous and almost chaotic celebration, he saw these deeper layers of meaning.

[00:26:26] Speaker B: Yeah, he was always looking for those deeper layers, always trying to understand the why behind the what. And, you know, that often led him to challenge the status quo even within his own community.

[00:26:36] Speaker C: Oh, right.

Didn't he have some issues with the authorities at Jews College and even with some of the official Jewish chaplains in the army?

[00:26:46] Speaker B: He did. It's almost unbelievable. When he applied to Jews College, they actually told him he knew too much Hebrew.

[00:26:53] Speaker C: Too much Hebrew? What does that even mean?

[00:26:55] Speaker B: Right. It's like they saw his knowledge and passion as a threat.

[00:26:58] Speaker C: Wow, that's crazy. So they rejected him because he was too Knowledgeable?

[00:27:03] Speaker B: Pretty much. And then later on, he ran into that same resistance from some of the chaplains during the war.

[00:27:08] Speaker C: It sounds like he was a bit of a rebel, huh?

[00:27:10] Speaker B: Yeah.

[00:27:10] Speaker C: Not afraid to shake things up a bit.

[00:27:12] Speaker B: Yeah, I think that's fair to say. But he wasn't doing it just to be provocative. He genuinely believed that true faith wasn't about blindly following the rules.

[00:27:20] Speaker C: Right. It was about engaging with the tradition in a meaningful way, asking tough questions, even challenging authority when necessary.

[00:27:28] Speaker B: Exactly. And, you know, that takes a lot of courage, especially during a time of war when conformity is often so highly valued.

[00:27:35] Speaker C: Absolutely. So as we're thinking about Casser's legacy, I'm wondering, what are the key takeaways here? What can we as listeners in the 21st century? What can we learn from his experiences?

[00:27:47] Speaker B: That's the big question, isn't it? I mean, his story is so unique, so specific to his time and place. But I do think there are some universal truths we can glean from his life.

[00:27:58] Speaker C: Like what? What are some of the things that stand out to you?

[00:28:01] Speaker B: Well, I think one of the biggest takeaways is that even in the darkest of times, hope can flourish.

[00:28:06] Speaker C: Hope can flourish. I like that. It's a powerful message, especially these days when it feels like the world is, well, full of challenges and uncertainty.

[00:28:14] Speaker B: Yeah, I agree. And I think Casser's story shows us that hope isn't about ignoring the darkness. It's about finding the light within it. It's about choosing to believe in the possibility of a better future, even when things are tough.

[00:28:26] Speaker C: Right. It's about that inner strength, that resilience. And Kasser and his men, they certainly faced some unimaginable challenges. Leaving their homes, their families, facing persecution, then a war. It's hard to even fathom what they went through.

[00:28:39] Speaker B: I know, but they found a way to hold on to their faith, their community, their sense of purpose.

[00:28:45] Speaker C: That's amazing. But it makes me wonder, did Casser ever experience moments of doubt? I mean, was his faith ever shaken by all that he saw and experienced?

[00:28:54] Speaker B: Oh, I'm sure he had moments of doubt, moments of frustration and disappointment, especially in his dealings with, you know, those who he felt weren't serving the community.

[00:29:03] Speaker C: Well, that makes sense. It'd be hard not to feel that way given everything he went through.

[00:29:08] Speaker B: Right. But you know what's so inspiring is that even in those moments, he never lost sight of his core values. He never stopped believing in the power of good, in the possibility of redemption.

[00:29:18] Speaker C: So it wasn't about pretending that Everything was okay. It was about finding that inner strength to persevere even when things were tough.

[00:29:25] Speaker B: Exactly. And that brings us to another important lesson, the power of courage. Kasser wasn't afraid to speak truth to power, to challenge authority, even within his own faith, when he felt it was necessary.

[00:29:36] Speaker C: Right. And that takes a lot of guts, especially when you're going against the grain, challenging the status quo.

[00:29:41] Speaker B: Yeah. And he wasn't just complaining, he was offering solutions. He was actively working to create a more supportive and inclusive community for his men.

[00:29:50] Speaker C: So it was about action, not just words. About putting your values into practice, even when it's hard.

[00:29:55] Speaker B: Exactly. And, you know, that brings us back to this idea of leadership. It's not about holding a position of power. It's about serving others. It's about leading by example, leading with empathy and understanding.

[00:30:06] Speaker C: Absolutely. And that's what made Casser's mobile fighting Gila so remarkable. It wasn't just a physical place. It was a spirit, a way of being that transcended the boundaries of wartime.

[00:30:18] Speaker B: And that's something we can all carry with us. That spirit of community, of support, of connection. It's about recognizing that we're all in this together and we all have something to contribute.

[00:30:27] Speaker C: I love that. And, you know, I think it's easy to get caught up in the negativity of the world, to feel overwhelmed by all the challenges we're facing. But Kasper's story reminds us that even in the darkest of times, there's always hope. There's always the possibility of connection, of finding meaning and purpose, of making a difference in the world.

[00:30:44] Speaker B: Absolutely. And his legacy continues to inspire us to do just that, to build bridges of understanding, to support each other, to work together to create a more just and compassionate world. It's just incredible to think about Casser creating this pocket of hope and resilience in the middle of the British Army.

[00:31:03] Speaker C: Right. Faced with such adversity, it's really.

[00:31:06] Speaker B: It speaks volumes about his character and his leadership. It's a good reminder that leadership. It's not about titles.

[00:31:12] Speaker C: No, not at all. It's about. It's about choices we make.

[00:31:15] Speaker B: Yeah.

[00:31:15] Speaker C: And the impact we have on. On others.

[00:31:18] Speaker B: Yeah. And I think a lot of people, I mean, myself included, could learn from Casser's approach.

[00:31:22] Speaker C: Absolutely.

[00:31:23] Speaker B: Like, he never shied away from tough conversations.

[00:31:26] Speaker C: Right.

[00:31:26] Speaker B: He wasn't afraid to challenge the status quo. He always, always put the needs of his community first.

[00:31:32] Speaker C: Yeah. A true servant leader. His legacy, it really does continue to inspire.

[00:31:37] Speaker B: It does. So as we kind of wrap up Our deep dive into Rabbi Kasser's life. I'm left with this question.

How can we take inspiration from his example? Like, how can we foster a deeper sense of community and understanding in our own lives?

[00:31:50] Speaker C: That's the million dollar question, isn't it?

[00:31:52] Speaker B: It is.

[00:31:53] Speaker C: But I do think it starts with recognizing how important empathy and connection are. Like, Kasser didn't just preach tolerance, he actually practiced it.

[00:32:04] Speaker B: He did.

[00:32:05] Speaker C: He sought to understand people even when he disagreed with them. And he created a space where people felt safe.

[00:32:13] Speaker B: Safe to what?

[00:32:14] Speaker C: Safe to express their doubts, their fears, their hopes.

[00:32:18] Speaker B: Yeah, that's huge. Like, just creating that safe space for people to be themselves.

[00:32:23] Speaker C: Exactly. Without judgment.

[00:32:25] Speaker B: It sounds like he was really good at building bridges, like, finding common ground even in the middle of conflict. And he didn't just focus on his own community either.

[00:32:33] Speaker C: No, he didn't.

[00:32:33] Speaker B: He, like, actively reached out to others. He built relationships with soldiers from different faiths, different backgrounds. It's pretty amazing.

[00:32:40] Speaker C: It is. It's like he understood that at the end of the day, we're all human.

[00:32:44] Speaker B: We are.

[00:32:45] Speaker C: We all share this common humanity, and that's something we can all strive for, you know, to what? To connect with people who are different from us, to listen to their stories, to find those shared values that bring us together?

[00:32:58] Speaker B: It's a good reminder that community, it's not just about shared beliefs or, you know, even experiences. No, it's about a willingness to, like, embrace our shared humanity.

[00:33:10] Speaker C: I love that. Embracing our shared humanity.

[00:33:12] Speaker B: Yeah, and just recognizing that, you know, we're all in this together.

[00:33:16] Speaker C: We are. Casser's story is such a powerful testament to that, to the power of human connection.

[00:33:21] Speaker B: It is. It shows how we can overcome even, like, the most daunting challenges when we come together.

[00:33:26] Speaker C: And his legacy, It's a call to action, isn't it, for all of us.

[00:33:30] Speaker B: To do what?

[00:33:31] Speaker C: To create our own mobile fighting keelas in our own way.

[00:33:35] Speaker B: I like that. So, like, finding ways to support each other, to build those bridges of understanding, to work together, to, you know, to make the world a little bit better, a little more.

[00:33:44] Speaker C: Just a little more compassionate, a little more hopeful.

[00:33:47] Speaker B: Yeah, that's a powerful. That's a powerful thought to end on. Thank you for joining us for this deep dive into the life of Rabbi Moses Jacob Gasser.

[00:33:55] Speaker C: Thank you for having me. It's been a pleasure.

[00:33:57] Speaker B: We hope you'll, you know, you'll continue to explore his story and that you find inspiration in his commitment to faith, community, and, well, just humanity. Till next time, everyone.

[00:34:10] Speaker A: I hope you enjoyed today's deep dive. If you'd like to discuss any of the questions or anything that you heard in the podcast or would like the team to do a deep dive into a different topic, please join the LinkedIn group and let me know. I look forward to providing you with many more deep dives into the applications of systems thinking.

Take care.